Thomas WalentaGlobal Project Economy ExpertHackenheim, Germany
Product breakdown is mentioned under product analysis.
A WBS may follow a PBS structure, but also a life cycle/sequence, or a contracting scheme, or you could have a mixture.
During a project, work might be necessary that does not create components of the product, think about a crane to build a house, testing, or just project management.
It should be part of the WBS, but I am not knowledgeable enough to see where to put it in a PBS. Saving Changes...
Hi Sergio, I guess you mean PBS is outside the PMs scope.
PBS is different from WBS.
But what does PMI say?
*Product scope.* The features and functions that characterize a product, service, or result.
*Project scope.* The work performed to deliver a product, service, or result with the specified features and functions. The term “project scope” is sometimes viewed as *including* product scope.
PMBOK pg131
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1 reply by Sergio Luis Conte
Jul 19, 2020 6:59 AM
Sergio Luis Conte
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Yes sorry. I mean PBS (Product Breakdown Structure) is outside the project manager (PM) scope. It is inside the business analyst (BA) scope. I debated a lot about inside the project scope the product scope is not included. The only thing I get is the inclusion of word "sometimes"..hehehe. Obviouly I am not alone on that. With that said, you know, lot of time we perform both roles, PM and BA.
Saving Changes...
Simon Harrisconsultant| Logical Model LtdEdinburgh, Midlothian, United Kingdom
There is a debate here that should be unnecessary but previous PMI publications have muddied the water more than others :(
Indisputably (I hope!) we do work ONLY to safely deliver a desired result.
Safe delivery may require control type work such as planning & documenting. Delivery inescapably requires product (or service) work such as design and build and test
The terms PBS & WBS mean what ever they are defined to mean by authors in context or if not locally defined then we have argument and debate. The PMI books changed over time - the 1st version of the wbs practice standard had inconsistencies within itself let alone to the then pmbok-g
Once upon a time PMI said approx [ WBS = PRODUCT oriented grouping of project elements ]. and was explicit that there is no work/ activity in a wbs - thats why the pmbok over most editions has activity lists in ch 6. A division that ISO changed when they published their 'almost the same as the pmbok' standard
PBS is most commonly associated with PRINCE where its very explicitly NO WORK (but all products: customer requested and intermediate and management whether acquired or created or amended)
Ultimately there is NO CORRECT ANSWER to what is one.
To ask "Which is best?" is a failure to understand their basic purposes - Its imperative to (eventually) conclude WHAT is to be or has been delivered
Its inescapable delivery requires activity to acquire or make or amend and integrate and deliver
Scope has three dimensions - What and How and How good (grade in pmbok-g vocabulary) - any endeavour must cope with the clarity or ambiguity in all three in the journey through project or operations
The REAL topic that text-books SHOULD have exposed is the TECHNIQUE nestled in the middle of all this; Decomposition (and then we'd also see the need to add synthesis - & we'd all have deeper insight Saving Changes...
Sergio Luis ConteHelping to create solutions for everyone| Worldwide based OrganizationsBuenos Aires, Argentina
Jul 19, 2020 2:14 AM
Replying to Richard Darko
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Hi Sergio, I guess you mean PBS is outside the PMs scope.
PBS is different from WBS.
But what does PMI say?
*Product scope.* The features and functions that characterize a product, service, or result.
*Project scope.* The work performed to deliver a product, service, or result with the specified features and functions. The term “project scope” is sometimes viewed as *including* product scope.
PMBOK pg131
Yes sorry. I mean PBS (Product Breakdown Structure) is outside the project manager (PM) scope. It is inside the business analyst (BA) scope. I debated a lot about inside the project scope the product scope is not included. The only thing I get is the inclusion of word "sometimes"..hehehe. Obviouly I am not alone on that. With that said, you know, lot of time we perform both roles, PM and BA. Saving Changes...
