I'm looking for examples of the use of Agile in non IT or non Product development.
In software product development agile is very applicable and I have seen Agile used to develop hardware prototypes. Also, some use of KanBan boards but this is normally operational type work.
If you have good examples for agile PROJECTS let me know. Saving Changes...
@David. I think when you named "new development game" you are refering to the Toyota related paper. This is Lean, not Agile. Scrum framework and some of the software method are based on Lean which is not the same than Agile. But not matter. Returning to your point here some examples, which I considered the most relevant, I had the pleasure to work in. 1-in 1999 we used DSDM in a construction project which, just to comment, owned an award from the PMI. 2-I used Scrum to transform the whole enterprise architecture inside one of the top 5 banks in the world. We used Crystal Clear too. 3-I implemented Scrum/XP and TDD in marketing/HR areas in several companies. 4-I implemented SAFe for using it in non software initiatives in my actual work place, mainly to manage portfolio. 5-I uses DA before it was acquired by the PMI for implemented Agile approach at whole enterprise. 6-I used Tom Gilb´s EVO and James Coplien´s Organizational Patterns to implement agile at whole enterprise.
I'd love to hear how to apply DSDM in construction that would be really interesting. Saving Changes...
Veerachai SuvarnapruksaFacility Support Engineer| PTT Exploration & Production PLCBangkok, Bangkok, Thailand
Dec 17, 2021 1:44 PM
Replying to David McCreery
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basically, I'm looking to answer the question when others ask me. Yes I'd like to see specific agile frameworks that were used in non IT non Product Projects.
For example, how would, Scrum, DAD, DSDM, Crystal or even how TDD would be applied.
Yes agile has it roots in manufacturing in particular the "new new product development game". But this does not help the average office person understand how it might be applicable to them.
I have used the nurses' station as a good example for KanBan and that works well the get people to understand that an empirical unplanned approach has advantages over a highly planned.
Hi David. I, too, have been tasked to look for case examples of applying Agile Approach (in whole or in part) for either Engineering or Construction Projects for the Energy Sector. I immediately thought about R&D for either Construction or Engineering projects that are complex in nature ... whereby we really are not sure of the outcome so the customer select Agile Approach for their project so that the cost of failure is kept at a minimum (fail fast and/or fail often). If you run into some good case examples I would love to hear about them.
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1 reply by Sergio Luis Conte
Dec 28, 2021 3:04 PM
Sergio Luis Conte
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The problem is the big mistake about "fail fast/fail often". I am not saying it because you wrote. I am saying it because people get this phrase by convenience without taking into account the whole context where the phrase was written. This is one of the big mistakes about agile, like "deliver faster" "deliver at low cost" etc etc. Because I am saying that? Not. I encourage people to go to the basement of agile (1990, USA DoD/Agility Forum, totally outside software domain) and to the implementation of Agile in software (before the manifesto) by searching the seminal papers in OOSPLA from 1995 up to date.
Saving Changes...
Sergio Luis ConteHelping to create solutions for everyone| Worldwide based OrganizationsBuenos Aires, Argentina
Dec 23, 2021 10:31 PM
Replying to Veerachai Suvarnapruksa
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Hi David. I, too, have been tasked to look for case examples of applying Agile Approach (in whole or in part) for either Engineering or Construction Projects for the Energy Sector. I immediately thought about R&D for either Construction or Engineering projects that are complex in nature ... whereby we really are not sure of the outcome so the customer select Agile Approach for their project so that the cost of failure is kept at a minimum (fail fast and/or fail often). If you run into some good case examples I would love to hear about them.
The problem is the big mistake about "fail fast/fail often". I am not saying it because you wrote. I am saying it because people get this phrase by convenience without taking into account the whole context where the phrase was written. This is one of the big mistakes about agile, like "deliver faster" "deliver at low cost" etc etc. Because I am saying that? Not. I encourage people to go to the basement of agile (1990, USA DoD/Agility Forum, totally outside software domain) and to the implementation of Agile in software (before the manifesto) by searching the seminal papers in OOSPLA from 1995 up to date. Saving Changes...
Veerachai SuvarnapruksaFacility Support Engineer| PTT Exploration & Production PLCBangkok, Bangkok, Thailand
Dec 18, 2021 11:07 AM
Replying to Sergio Luis Conte
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@David. I think when you named "new development game" you are refering to the Toyota related paper. This is Lean, not Agile. Scrum framework and some of the software method are based on Lean which is not the same than Agile. But not matter. Returning to your point here some examples, which I considered the most relevant, I had the pleasure to work in. 1-in 1999 we used DSDM in a construction project which, just to comment, owned an award from the PMI. 2-I used Scrum to transform the whole enterprise architecture inside one of the top 5 banks in the world. We used Crystal Clear too. 3-I implemented Scrum/XP and TDD in marketing/HR areas in several companies. 4-I implemented SAFe for using it in non software initiatives in my actual work place, mainly to manage portfolio. 5-I uses DA before it was acquired by the PMI for implemented Agile approach at whole enterprise. 6-I used Tom Gilb´s EVO and James Coplien´s Organizational Patterns to implement agile at whole enterprise.
Dear Sergio ... Happy Holidays to you and your family. In regards to your comment about a Construction Project using DSDM in year 1999 that received PMI award ... are there archived mention in PMI site that I can look up any summary or write-up on the project?
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1 reply by Sergio Luis Conte
Dec 29, 2021 5:27 AM
Sergio Luis Conte
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To be honest, I do not know if the PMI keeps this type of things in one place. And to be honest, the award did not mean anything for me except the point some other people recognizes in some way that "non traditional" methodologies can be used. Related to DSDM, it was "the official" method adopted by the British Government from long time ago (and I do not if it is active today) then you can find lot of examples for using it outside the software field. Unfortunately DSDM "owners" was changed along the years and it becomes from a free of use method where the community could support and modify it (in fact, I was part of the group which write versions 1 to 3 of the method) to something that is in hands of the Agile Business Consortium. This change of strategy, in my opinion, jeopardizes the method was "more famous". What made the method strong is the posibility to integrate to it things like PRINCE2, XP and others. So, it could be "easy" to think a construction project using DSDM as the way of delivering the product. The objective of this project was created low cost houses, a complete neighborhood, based on a project created by Cesar Pelli. It implies to use traditional brick and mortar construction which is used in my country Argentina. Again, Agile is not about a method/framework or life cycle. My commendation is to read sometimes forgotten seminal things like Tom Gilb´s EVO or Allistar Cockburn Crystal Clear or, what it could be better, the original papers created inside the USA/DoD Agility Forum in 1990, the place where Agile was born.
Saving Changes...
Sergio Luis ConteHelping to create solutions for everyone| Worldwide based OrganizationsBuenos Aires, Argentina
Dec 28, 2021 9:01 PM
Replying to Veerachai Suvarnapruksa
...
Dear Sergio ... Happy Holidays to you and your family. In regards to your comment about a Construction Project using DSDM in year 1999 that received PMI award ... are there archived mention in PMI site that I can look up any summary or write-up on the project?
To be honest, I do not know if the PMI keeps this type of things in one place. And to be honest, the award did not mean anything for me except the point some other people recognizes in some way that "non traditional" methodologies can be used. Related to DSDM, it was "the official" method adopted by the British Government from long time ago (and I do not if it is active today) then you can find lot of examples for using it outside the software field. Unfortunately DSDM "owners" was changed along the years and it becomes from a free of use method where the community could support and modify it (in fact, I was part of the group which write versions 1 to 3 of the method) to something that is in hands of the Agile Business Consortium. This change of strategy, in my opinion, jeopardizes the method was "more famous". What made the method strong is the posibility to integrate to it things like PRINCE2, XP and others. So, it could be "easy" to think a construction project using DSDM as the way of delivering the product. The objective of this project was created low cost houses, a complete neighborhood, based on a project created by Cesar Pelli. It implies to use traditional brick and mortar construction which is used in my country Argentina. Again, Agile is not about a method/framework or life cycle. My commendation is to read sometimes forgotten seminal things like Tom Gilb´s EVO or Allistar Cockburn Crystal Clear or, what it could be better, the original papers created inside the USA/DoD Agility Forum in 1990, the place where Agile was born. Saving Changes...
