Sean MatthewsCommercial Project Manager| Practical Plumbing Co. Ltd.London, Ontario, Canada
Hi everybody,
I'm looking for the easiest way to explain the difference between "work" and "duration" columns in scheduling software to people who have no idea about scheduling.
The schedule itself should be set to fixed duration but was set to fixed work and for the most part the duration column was left to the default 8h.
Stéphane ParentSelf Employed / Semi-retired| Leader MakerPrince Edward Island, Canada
Work, usually expressed in hours, is the effort required to complete the activity.
Duration, usually expressed in days, is the period over which the effort is spent.
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1 reply by Sean Matthews
Apr 11, 2016 9:19 PM
Sean Matthews
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Stephane,
That's basicially what I was thinking.
Now comes the next part, when you schedule using fixed work and estimate (what we'll call the duration of the task to various times) but the actual duration column is left at a default 8h you have 2 very different times.
I guess the question now becomes, will your estimates be calculated accurately by the software, and what columns (given in typical softare) would you be looking for the differential on? I'd assume that you'd be recording "actual work" as your time to complete the task?
Saving Changes...
Sean MatthewsCommercial Project Manager| Practical Plumbing Co. Ltd.London, Ontario, Canada
Apr 11, 2016 8:31 PM
Replying to Stéphane Parent
...
Work, usually expressed in hours, is the effort required to complete the activity.
Duration, usually expressed in days, is the period over which the effort is spent.
Stephane,
That's basicially what I was thinking.
Now comes the next part, when you schedule using fixed work and estimate (what we'll call the duration of the task to various times) but the actual duration column is left at a default 8h you have 2 very different times.
I guess the question now becomes, will your estimates be calculated accurately by the software, and what columns (given in typical softare) would you be looking for the differential on? I'd assume that you'd be recording "actual work" as your time to complete the task? Saving Changes...
Praveen MalikIndependent Consultant| Independent ConsultantNew Delhi, India
Sean, There is a difference between work and duration. As Stephane pointed out work is the "effort" required to complete a task. More appropriately, we can say work (effort) is number of labor units required to complete a task. Effort can be expressed in hours but better unit is 'person hours'. Duration is the length of time required to complete a task. Duration can also be expressed in hours but better unit is work hours.
Saving Changes...
Darren KosaPlanning & Controls ContractorHampshire, United Kingdom
Hi Sean,
Echoing what Stéphane and Praveen have both said, Work is how much effort your resources intend to expend completing a task, and Duration is the time period available for that task to be completed in.
Once you have baselined your schedule and want to update tasks to reflect progress, I would always recommend using Actual Work and Remaining Work, as well as Actual Duration and Remaining Duration.
No scheduling software is intuitive enough to know how much time or effort remains, they just deduct Actuals from the estimate to determine Progress.
That would be fine if everything went to plan, but in the real world, you still need to work with your teams to ensure that the task can be completed with the hours you originally assigned and by the forecast date you originally agreed.
Regards,
Darren Kosa Saving Changes...
Sean MatthewsCommercial Project Manager| Practical Plumbing Co. Ltd.London, Ontario, Canada
Thanks to all three of you for the help and answers. I think I've got it the best way to go about it.
Cheers. Saving Changes...
Stéphane ParentSelf Employed / Semi-retired| Leader MakerPrince Edward Island, Canada
Sean,
You mentioned Fixed Work. I'm guessing you're using Microsoft Project. Please understand that the Task Type will drive how Project adjusts your tasks.
Once you have resources allocated to a task, Project tries to adjust Work, Duration and Units every time you make a change.
If you pick Task Type of Fixed Work, changing the Units will force Project to adjust Duration. If you change the Duration, Project will adjust the Units. In both cases, Project will leave Work alone.
The lesson is: before you plan on updating Work, Duration or Units make sure you set Task Type accordingly so that Project will know what should be changed.
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1 reply by Sean Matthews
Apr 12, 2016 8:55 AM
Sean Matthews
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Stephane,
I'm actually using Clarizen, I'm only in my first week of trying to figure Clarizen out and how the templates were created and how things were done, prior to my coming to this company. From what I've seen so far, some templates were created with fixed work and some with fixed duration, however all estimates have been given in the work column.
It seems to me that Clarizen and Project do things similarly.
I got used to doing things in Project and using a fixed duration and estimating task time in the duration column and never using the work columns at all. With what I've read from the replies to my question, I'm beginning to think that was incorrect and should report the work logged against a task in the work column, or an actual duration?
Stephane,
I'm actually using Clarizen, I'm only in my first week of trying to figure Clarizen out and how the templates were created and how things were done, prior to my coming to this company. From what I've seen so far, some templates were created with fixed work and some with fixed duration, however all estimates have been given in the work column.
It seems to me that Clarizen and Project do things similarily.
I just look through one of my MS project books and realized that WORK=DURATION*UNITS, if Clarizen is doing the same, this could be part of my problem. Thanks very much for the help, greatly appreciated.
Saving Changes...
Sean MatthewsCommercial Project Manager| Practical Plumbing Co. Ltd.London, Ontario, Canada
Apr 12, 2016 7:31 AM
Replying to Stéphane Parent
...
Sean,
You mentioned Fixed Work. I'm guessing you're using Microsoft Project. Please understand that the Task Type will drive how Project adjusts your tasks.
Once you have resources allocated to a task, Project tries to adjust Work, Duration and Units every time you make a change.
If you pick Task Type of Fixed Work, changing the Units will force Project to adjust Duration. If you change the Duration, Project will adjust the Units. In both cases, Project will leave Work alone.
The lesson is: before you plan on updating Work, Duration or Units make sure you set Task Type accordingly so that Project will know what should be changed.
Stephane,
I'm actually using Clarizen, I'm only in my first week of trying to figure Clarizen out and how the templates were created and how things were done, prior to my coming to this company. From what I've seen so far, some templates were created with fixed work and some with fixed duration, however all estimates have been given in the work column.
It seems to me that Clarizen and Project do things similarly.
I got used to doing things in Project and using a fixed duration and estimating task time in the duration column and never using the work columns at all. With what I've read from the replies to my question, I'm beginning to think that was incorrect and should report the work logged against a task in the work column, or an actual duration?
Stephane,
I'm actually using Clarizen, I'm only in my first week of trying to figure Clarizen out and how the templates were created and how things were done, prior to my coming to this company. From what I've seen so far, some templates were created with fixed work and some with fixed duration, however all estimates have been given in the work column.
It seems to me that Clarizen and Project do things similarily.
I just look through one of my MS project books and realized that WORK=DURATION*UNITS, if Clarizen is doing the same, this could be part of my problem. Thanks very much for the help, greatly appreciated. Saving Changes...
Sean MatthewsCommercial Project Manager| Practical Plumbing Co. Ltd.London, Ontario, Canada
I also just went back and look through one of my MS Project books and realized that work is a calculated field (Work=duration * units), if Clarizen is the same, then this could be a part of my problem as well. Saving Changes...
Stéphane ParentSelf Employed / Semi-retired| Leader MakerPrince Edward Island, Canada
From a purist point of view, you want to come up with an estimated effort (work) first. The idea is that the duration would then be derived by the units applied to the effort, given a certain calendar.
In reality, you will often get estimates in "days". When you do, you are usually getting a duration estimate, not a work estimate.
As long as you understand the mechanics of the equation, you can go ahead in whatever way is convenient to you and the estimators.
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1 reply by Sean Matthews
Apr 12, 2016 12:23 PM
Sean Matthews
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Ok, that's what I was thinking.
The real issue I've got is that I'm going based on a template that I didn't create in a program that I'm only just learning. I'm trying to understand the logic that was applied by a person who is no longer here with others around me that only have a very basic understanding.
Again, thanks very much for all the help.
Saving Changes...
Sean MatthewsCommercial Project Manager| Practical Plumbing Co. Ltd.London, Ontario, Canada
Apr 12, 2016 12:13 PM
Replying to Stéphane Parent
...
From a purist point of view, you want to come up with an estimated effort (work) first. The idea is that the duration would then be derived by the units applied to the effort, given a certain calendar.
In reality, you will often get estimates in "days". When you do, you are usually getting a duration estimate, not a work estimate.
As long as you understand the mechanics of the equation, you can go ahead in whatever way is convenient to you and the estimators.
Ok, that's what I was thinking.
The real issue I've got is that I'm going based on a template that I didn't create in a program that I'm only just learning. I'm trying to understand the logic that was applied by a person who is no longer here with others around me that only have a very basic understanding.
Again, thanks very much for all the help. Saving Changes...
