Advanced PMI Certifications in Project Management

George,

Would the initial PMP exam still be a requirement for someone who had say 20+ years experience to then qualify and take the next exam OR could this individual just take / sit for the more advanced / higher PMP certification bypassing the initial PMP exam? What would this exam compose of in order to differentiate those with less experience? At which point, I would ask is it a matter of more certifications that is needed or is the issue something different entirely? I like the topic and look forward to hearing more discussion.

If you look at certifications in some other professions (take PM as a profession for this discussion), there is only this entry-level certification. After that you are certified (take medical doctors, engineers, architects etc.). Some professions add special add-on certifications for specialization or to certify special knowledge (again see different medical doctors as specialization or add-on - at least that's so here in Germany, I don't know about other parts of the world).
Higher experience is not certified in that professions, as far as I know. If you take guilds in the past, there have been different levels: apprentice, journeyman, master, Apprentice was nothing else than a Scholar, a journeyman was still learning and widening his knowledge while practicing and a journeyman wasn't allowed to own a business/company - this was the privilege of masters who should have much experience and a wide knowledge (at least in theory). In Germany we have that system still in place for many professions.
So what do you think PMP level is? A journeyman - then what would be the additional knowledge for a master - or a master - then we don't need a higher certification.

I've heard variations of the "everybody's a PMP these days" comment in the past and I always point out, "Keep in mind, there are PMPs in every career area, from A to Z; not just IT and construction." It's amazing how often people stop dead in their tracks with a blank look on their face as they never considered that point.

I earned my PMP (# 86109) in Dec 1999, or as I put it, "before it was cool". I have 33 years of PM experience and a Master's of Science in Management degree specializing in project management. I also hold Level II in program management in the Department of Defense Acquisition Professional Development Program.

Over the last eight years, I started advocating among PMPs and to PMI for the PMP to become a government-issued license just like "professional surveyor" and "professional engineer". I have encountered only 2 PMPs who were open to the idea of legal licensure. PMI was cool to the idea, claiming there were many issues in the global arena, a point I find odd considering doctors can obtain their local license when they move from country to country, provided they meet the issuing state or country's requirements.

When I discuss legal licensing of PMs, some people express reluctance due to concerns about passing another exam. A grandfathering approach to licensing might be a suitable method for overcoming that concern. Others, mainly engineering types I encountered in these discussions, felt PM was not a "profession" like, well, engineering, so licensing was not appropriate. That argument suffers fatally from a specious foundation considering in many areas of the US individuals such as barbers, cosmetologists, nurses, electricians and plumbers require legal licenses to practice their trade.

Incidentally, the MSM program I graduated from did not "teach the PMP exam", but rather taught the concepts, theories and application of the PM principles. The university waived only one course out of that degree program if you already had your PMP.

I've heard variations of the "everybody's a PMP these days" comment in the past and I always point out, "Keep in mind, there are PMPs in every career area, from A to Z; not just IT and construction." It's amazing how often people stop dead in their tracks with a blank look on their face as they never considered that point.

I earned my PMP (# 86109) in Dec 1999, or as I put it, "before it was cool". I have 33 years of PM experience and a Master's of Science in Management degree specializing in project management. I also hold Level II in program management in the Department of Defense Acquisition Professional Development Program.

Over the last eight years, I started advocating among PMPs and to PMI for the PMP to become a government-issued license just like "professional surveyor" and "professional engineer". I have encountered only 2 PMPs who were open to the idea of legal licensure. PMI was cool to the idea, claiming there were many issues in the global arena, a point I find odd considering doctors can obtain their local license when they move from country to country, provided they meet the issuing state or country's requirements.

When I discuss legal licensing of PMs, some people express reluctance due to concerns about passing another exam. A grandfathering approach to licensing might be a suitable method for overcoming that concern. Others, mainly engineering types I encountered in these discussions, felt PM was not a "profession" like, well, engineering, so licensing was not appropriate. That argument suffers fatally from a specious foundation considering in many areas of the US individuals such as barbers, cosmetologists, nurses, electricians and plumbers require legal licenses to practice their trade.

Incidentally, the MSM program I graduated from did not "teach the PMP exam", but rather taught the concepts, theories and application of the PM principles. The university waived only one course out of that degree program if you already had your PMP.

hi George, and yes a good question (as with any profession that requires certification) the same could be said about my CPA. Just because he/she is a CPA does that mean they are the best CPA for me? How do I know they are the best person to do my taxes?

Getting your professional certification is the first start. That proves to future employers and clients you "know your stuff". Now, does that mean they can handle a multi-million dollar portfolio from the start? Uhm, no. Getting your certification is one thing. What you do after that is another. There are many folks out there 20+ years of experience with out a PMP that are exceptional project managers and never saw the need to get certified. Then there are folks just 2-3 years starting out that get PMP certified so that they get a good start to their career. If I were hiring manager, for sure get minimum years experience 7+ and PMP to start, but what do they specialize in? What is their success rate? What is the client feedback? How do they socialize/brand themselves? If all you do is look at whether a person is certified, you are no way sure if they are completely qualified with enough proper experience to handle the work successfully that you want them to do. (And I went through three CPAs before I found the right one for me).

If "every body is a PMP these days" why is that a bad thing? Firstly getting certified is no small feat. Did you know that there are folks with many years of project experience that are not able to pass PMP exam? The more people that care to get certified and do the extra work to get certified. then that turns into better potential for success on projects because everyone is working from the same playbook. And if someone has 20+ years experience and then gets PMP then they have an exceptional amount of expertise behind them that a PMP with 2-3 years experience simply will not have. In addition, how would you start to identify what Advance PMP is? Having 100thousand hours of project time? Having managed 50 projects worth $X millions of dollars? If you could get PMP, Prince2 and IPMA certified would that be advanced enough? At what point is "chasing cert" to prove expertise too much?

My point is... it's not the cert that makes you exceptional, it is who you are, what you did , what you do and how do it that makes you the top of your field. The PMP cert is just another tool in your Experts Toolkit.