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How seriously do you take customer feedback?

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Ram Narayanan Sastry Product Analyst| Toshiba Medical Systems Corporation Nasushiobara-Shi, Tochigi-Ken, Japan
One of the greatest minds of this era, Steve Jobs, always thought that the customer does not really know what is needed? Visionary companies need to show the customer the product before they can realize it.

I generally tend to agree with this viewpoint of Steve Jobs and have detailed my views on this in this blog article:
https://ramadvice.wordpress.com/2016/05/29...-really-matter/

What do you feel about this viewpoint? Do you agree customer feedback is probably overblown these days?
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Simon Lange Program Manager| NSW Health North Strathfield, Nsw, Australia
Hi Ram,

From a purely project management perspective, the customer provides the ultimate success measure. I know that we project managers love to get a set of requirements approved, but things change, customer change, and if a customer is not happy, then that can mean an unpaid invoice or terrible public feedback. Product development is different, and I think that is what Steve Jobs is referring to.

You make a great point in the last few sentences of your blog post:
"More important is the engagement with the customer in understanding the workflows, the day to day working, the innate understanding of the pain points of the customer and the experience the customer craves for, all of which can only come when we engage with the customer in a more closer manner."

When a project team engages with a customer in this manner, at regular intervals along the project lifecycle, and adjusts the project product based on customer feedback, then the end product will be exactly what the customer has designed and not a surprise. In this way, you can engineer a situation where your customers feedback is positive.

What do you think?

Cheers,

Simon
...
1 reply by Ram Narayanan Sastry
Jan 28, 2017 7:23 PM
Ram Narayanan Sastry
...
Hi Simon,
Thanks for the insightful comments.

While I agree with the gist of your comment, there is a subtle difference in one aspect of customer feedback that I have tried to highlight in this article. While it is important to hear the customer's feedback and understand the problem statement, the problem starts when we start to take the customers solutions on the face value and start to build it into the product. This happens more often than not and is one of the main reasons why the final product deviates significantly from the original and soon becomes unmanageable. This also leads to the what I call as "God Customers" where the loudest and the most critical customer starts to dominate the shaping of the product.

As long as we as project managers understand this aspect, I think we can handle customer feedback better.

Cheers!
Ram
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Tom Björkholm Consultant| Knowit Connectivity Linköping, Sweden
The word "customer" may mean different things in different contexts. For the sake of clarity I will use either the work "sponsor" or the phrase "end user".

As Simon also mentions a project must always take sponsor feedback very seriously.

When it comes to end user feedback it depends what kind of project your are running. The end user will never give you a feedback that you can use as requirements for developing a revolutionary new product or service. The end user feedback provides information on fine tuning details in evolutionary projects. (However, fine tuning these details may be very important for customer satisfaction.)

Normally the mindset of the end user is very limited by the way the product/service he/she is using right now works.

Even in an evolutionary project you need to listen to the end user feedback, and then ask the user why she/he wants that change. If you discover the underlying reason, you might often come up with better solutions than the fine tuning the user asked for. I have had these discussions with end users, and often it ends with the user saying "Is that possible. If that's is possible, it is a lot better. That would be great."
...
2 replies by Ram Narayanan Sastry and Simon Lange
Jan 28, 2017 7:27 PM
Ram Narayanan Sastry
...
Hi Tom,
Thanks for the insightful comments.

Completely agree with your thoughts. That is exactly how the customer feedback needs to be processed.

The problem is that in today's world of aggressive deadlines and ever shortening development lifecycles, many product teams just take the shortcut of doing what the most vocal customer says and move on!! This leads to significant challenges downstream.

Cheers!
Ram
Jan 29, 2017 3:23 PM
Simon Lange
...
Hi Tom,

A important clarification - customer can have different meanings and end user and sponsor do suit Ram's initial post.

The context of the project would define when the terms are suited, and my answer is based on my experience in project management where the project has a defined customer (or sponsor, as you would say) who defines the problems and requirements, and understands the result that needs to be acheived.

The role of the project is to
(a) capture all requirements,
(b) define the mandatory and 'nice to have' requirements, and the selection criteria for solutions,
(c) evaluate solutions that can satisfy requirements (could be a Request for quote or Request for proposal),
(d) propose a solution which meets all defined selection criteria, and (e) contract, design, build, test and implement the selected solution.

During the testing phase of the project, some subset of end users would be selected to evaluate the solution based on the requirements and the selection criteria defined by the sponsor at the start of the project. In this context, my "customer" includes both sponsor and end user.

I've had situations where a customer (my definition) has agreed on something as a high level solution, but when the project deliverable is presented (as final product or as a prototype) the customer has complained that it does not align to the expected "look and feel" and the project has been forced to reevaluate. I have had more than my fair share of God customers (have we worked in the same company Ram???), and my best response to date is a tight definition phase with clear acceptance criteria signed off, and then iterative prototype demonstrations so the customer always know progress and can suggest minor adjustments.

The approach that Ram defined seemed to be more 'product management' than project management.

However, the tension that you refer to - which occurs in many contexts - needs to mitigate the risk that customers are not always the best reference points when it comes to functionality and features, because as you say, their perspective is limited by their current experience. This can be restrictive.

Great conversation Tom and Ram, thanks for engaging with me on this!

Simon
avatar
Ram Narayanan Sastry Product Analyst| Toshiba Medical Systems Corporation Nasushiobara-Shi, Tochigi-Ken, Japan
Jan 28, 2017 11:47 AM
Replying to Simon Lange
...
Hi Ram,

From a purely project management perspective, the customer provides the ultimate success measure. I know that we project managers love to get a set of requirements approved, but things change, customer change, and if a customer is not happy, then that can mean an unpaid invoice or terrible public feedback. Product development is different, and I think that is what Steve Jobs is referring to.

You make a great point in the last few sentences of your blog post:
"More important is the engagement with the customer in understanding the workflows, the day to day working, the innate understanding of the pain points of the customer and the experience the customer craves for, all of which can only come when we engage with the customer in a more closer manner."

When a project team engages with a customer in this manner, at regular intervals along the project lifecycle, and adjusts the project product based on customer feedback, then the end product will be exactly what the customer has designed and not a surprise. In this way, you can engineer a situation where your customers feedback is positive.

What do you think?

Cheers,

Simon
Hi Simon,
Thanks for the insightful comments.

While I agree with the gist of your comment, there is a subtle difference in one aspect of customer feedback that I have tried to highlight in this article. While it is important to hear the customer's feedback and understand the problem statement, the problem starts when we start to take the customers solutions on the face value and start to build it into the product. This happens more often than not and is one of the main reasons why the final product deviates significantly from the original and soon becomes unmanageable. This also leads to the what I call as "God Customers" where the loudest and the most critical customer starts to dominate the shaping of the product.

As long as we as project managers understand this aspect, I think we can handle customer feedback better.

Cheers!
Ram
avatar
Ram Narayanan Sastry Product Analyst| Toshiba Medical Systems Corporation Nasushiobara-Shi, Tochigi-Ken, Japan
Jan 28, 2017 4:08 PM
Replying to Tom Björkholm
...
The word "customer" may mean different things in different contexts. For the sake of clarity I will use either the work "sponsor" or the phrase "end user".

As Simon also mentions a project must always take sponsor feedback very seriously.

When it comes to end user feedback it depends what kind of project your are running. The end user will never give you a feedback that you can use as requirements for developing a revolutionary new product or service. The end user feedback provides information on fine tuning details in evolutionary projects. (However, fine tuning these details may be very important for customer satisfaction.)

Normally the mindset of the end user is very limited by the way the product/service he/she is using right now works.

Even in an evolutionary project you need to listen to the end user feedback, and then ask the user why she/he wants that change. If you discover the underlying reason, you might often come up with better solutions than the fine tuning the user asked for. I have had these discussions with end users, and often it ends with the user saying "Is that possible. If that's is possible, it is a lot better. That would be great."
Hi Tom,
Thanks for the insightful comments.

Completely agree with your thoughts. That is exactly how the customer feedback needs to be processed.

The problem is that in today's world of aggressive deadlines and ever shortening development lifecycles, many product teams just take the shortcut of doing what the most vocal customer says and move on!! This leads to significant challenges downstream.

Cheers!
Ram
avatar
Simon Lange Program Manager| NSW Health North Strathfield, Nsw, Australia
Jan 28, 2017 4:08 PM
Replying to Tom Björkholm
...
The word "customer" may mean different things in different contexts. For the sake of clarity I will use either the work "sponsor" or the phrase "end user".

As Simon also mentions a project must always take sponsor feedback very seriously.

When it comes to end user feedback it depends what kind of project your are running. The end user will never give you a feedback that you can use as requirements for developing a revolutionary new product or service. The end user feedback provides information on fine tuning details in evolutionary projects. (However, fine tuning these details may be very important for customer satisfaction.)

Normally the mindset of the end user is very limited by the way the product/service he/she is using right now works.

Even in an evolutionary project you need to listen to the end user feedback, and then ask the user why she/he wants that change. If you discover the underlying reason, you might often come up with better solutions than the fine tuning the user asked for. I have had these discussions with end users, and often it ends with the user saying "Is that possible. If that's is possible, it is a lot better. That would be great."
Hi Tom,

A important clarification - customer can have different meanings and end user and sponsor do suit Ram's initial post.

The context of the project would define when the terms are suited, and my answer is based on my experience in project management where the project has a defined customer (or sponsor, as you would say) who defines the problems and requirements, and understands the result that needs to be acheived.

The role of the project is to
(a) capture all requirements,
(b) define the mandatory and 'nice to have' requirements, and the selection criteria for solutions,
(c) evaluate solutions that can satisfy requirements (could be a Request for quote or Request for proposal),
(d) propose a solution which meets all defined selection criteria, and (e) contract, design, build, test and implement the selected solution.

During the testing phase of the project, some subset of end users would be selected to evaluate the solution based on the requirements and the selection criteria defined by the sponsor at the start of the project. In this context, my "customer" includes both sponsor and end user.

I've had situations where a customer (my definition) has agreed on something as a high level solution, but when the project deliverable is presented (as final product or as a prototype) the customer has complained that it does not align to the expected "look and feel" and the project has been forced to reevaluate. I have had more than my fair share of God customers (have we worked in the same company Ram???), and my best response to date is a tight definition phase with clear acceptance criteria signed off, and then iterative prototype demonstrations so the customer always know progress and can suggest minor adjustments.

The approach that Ram defined seemed to be more 'product management' than project management.

However, the tension that you refer to - which occurs in many contexts - needs to mitigate the risk that customers are not always the best reference points when it comes to functionality and features, because as you say, their perspective is limited by their current experience. This can be restrictive.

Great conversation Tom and Ram, thanks for engaging with me on this!

Simon
avatar
Sergio Luis Conte Helping to create solutions for everyone| Worldwide based Organizations Buenos Aires, Argentina
What Jobs said when is taking literally is a wrong interpretation. Clients always know what they want but they do not know how to articulate it. That is basic to be successful as company. And it is the basement of quality. That is becasue the act to understand the client is named "elicitation". With that said, here comes a strategical decision: to be proactive or to be reactive.That is the dilema the organization has to solve at strategical level.
avatar
Ram Narayanan Sastry Product Analyst| Toshiba Medical Systems Corporation Nasushiobara-Shi, Tochigi-Ken, Japan
Sergio,
I tend to partially agree with your opinion that for some customers the problem is only of articulations. But, I think there is also the bigger problem with many customers who actually have a need, but do not know what they want. In my personal experience when I have talked with doctors, they have often told what they need in the context of the software or tools that they currently have. But when we have shown them something very disruptive from their current work, it suddenly dawns on them that what they actually wanted was something else and they whole heartedly join in to support it. I have found that this has happened many times in my experiences with Medical software.

I think it is this aspect that Jobs is trying to point out.
...
1 reply by Sergio Luis Conte
Feb 02, 2017 6:55 AM
Sergio Luis Conte
...
Sorry but now we are "mixing" things in my understanding. The first thing to do is to work on "the problem". The problem will trigger the need. But here is the first key: problem is defined as the gap between the perceived reality and the desire reality. So, we need (the business analyst) must work on the perception or on the desire or on the gap. Most of the time, there is no problem to solve (when you work on the perception). In the case of Apple, 3M, Toyota (where I was the pleasure to work) they go further: they do not have client or customer to work with. That is because Job usually said: clients do not know what they want until you show it to them. I mean, most of the times, when the organization takes a proactive strategy, it has to take into account that there is not a stakeholder to interact with to define the product/service/result. But again, clients or customers always know what they want/desire/wishes and people who have to translate it into requirements must understand that. What you describe is explained by the Lehman Laws of change. Time ago I wrote an article that was published by the PMI. And sorry but the situation demmands a review on the process to get needs (elicitation) and manage stakeholders. We are facing this type of situations into each initiative.
avatar
Sergio Luis Conte Helping to create solutions for everyone| Worldwide based Organizations Buenos Aires, Argentina
With all my due respect, I fully disagree with people that said "customer do not know what is needed". That is the reason because roles like business analyst has been created because to think in this way has generated things like "software chaos" or the main reason because project fails: customer of client do not receive what they need and it is fitness for use. Forget Jobs or Apple for a moment. The art to work with requirements is that you ever elicit needs/wants/desieres/wishes/etc that you have to translate into requirements. Is the same for each of us in our daily life. So, compnies that take the strategy to create environmental changes instead of react to them deliver to the market things that exceed customer expectation. But be sure about they think and tried to understand what people need/want/desire before create something. One of the problems is that we have public information about the success. But it is difficult to find information about fails. One of the most incredible companies in that sence is 3M. 3M has the ability to convert a fail into success. So, we need to understand that customer ever know what it need/want/desire/wishes and people (like me and others) that is working with requirements have the duty to help people to articulate that. And by the way, taking into account that product/service/result requirements is not the same (and will determine) project requirements.
...
1 reply by Ram Narayanan Sastry
Feb 01, 2017 11:30 PM
Ram Narayanan Sastry
...
Sergio,
Again I partially agree with you. Kindly note that a product has many customers and not just one or two. While each customer has a general idea what he or she wants, the ideas could be very contradicting while fitting together in a product. So yes the roles like business analyst have been created for exactly avoiding this situation. But what this article deals about is how the business analyst or a Product Analyst has to approach the customer feedback. The intent of the article is not to say that we do not need to listen to customer feedback, but rather to sensitize on how to interpret the feedback. Whether to take it literally or to dig deeper and understand what the underlying problem is. I will give a recent example where one of our customers was very particular about one workflow and he kept repeating that he wanted to do it a different way else he cannot use the product effectively. And based on this customers feedback a couple of times the company altered the product, but the customer never seemed pleased with it even though the implementation was exactly what he had asked for. Then we setup a detailed session with him where a couple of us just decided to monitor him as he undergoes his routine and then we figured out that his actual problem lay in the way the hospital network and other equipment was configured to work with our system. And believe me, once that problem got fixed, he was more than happy to go back to the old way in which the software was originally designed as that was the better way to do his work. It is instances such as this which highlight the need to listen to the customer, but more importantly understand what he needs rather than what he wants.
avatar
Ram Narayanan Sastry Product Analyst| Toshiba Medical Systems Corporation Nasushiobara-Shi, Tochigi-Ken, Japan
Feb 01, 2017 7:11 AM
Replying to Sergio Luis Conte
...
With all my due respect, I fully disagree with people that said "customer do not know what is needed". That is the reason because roles like business analyst has been created because to think in this way has generated things like "software chaos" or the main reason because project fails: customer of client do not receive what they need and it is fitness for use. Forget Jobs or Apple for a moment. The art to work with requirements is that you ever elicit needs/wants/desieres/wishes/etc that you have to translate into requirements. Is the same for each of us in our daily life. So, compnies that take the strategy to create environmental changes instead of react to them deliver to the market things that exceed customer expectation. But be sure about they think and tried to understand what people need/want/desire before create something. One of the problems is that we have public information about the success. But it is difficult to find information about fails. One of the most incredible companies in that sence is 3M. 3M has the ability to convert a fail into success. So, we need to understand that customer ever know what it need/want/desire/wishes and people (like me and others) that is working with requirements have the duty to help people to articulate that. And by the way, taking into account that product/service/result requirements is not the same (and will determine) project requirements.
Sergio,
Again I partially agree with you. Kindly note that a product has many customers and not just one or two. While each customer has a general idea what he or she wants, the ideas could be very contradicting while fitting together in a product. So yes the roles like business analyst have been created for exactly avoiding this situation. But what this article deals about is how the business analyst or a Product Analyst has to approach the customer feedback. The intent of the article is not to say that we do not need to listen to customer feedback, but rather to sensitize on how to interpret the feedback. Whether to take it literally or to dig deeper and understand what the underlying problem is. I will give a recent example where one of our customers was very particular about one workflow and he kept repeating that he wanted to do it a different way else he cannot use the product effectively. And based on this customers feedback a couple of times the company altered the product, but the customer never seemed pleased with it even though the implementation was exactly what he had asked for. Then we setup a detailed session with him where a couple of us just decided to monitor him as he undergoes his routine and then we figured out that his actual problem lay in the way the hospital network and other equipment was configured to work with our system. And believe me, once that problem got fixed, he was more than happy to go back to the old way in which the software was originally designed as that was the better way to do his work. It is instances such as this which highlight the need to listen to the customer, but more importantly understand what he needs rather than what he wants.
avatar
Sergio Luis Conte Helping to create solutions for everyone| Worldwide based Organizations Buenos Aires, Argentina
Jan 31, 2017 8:27 PM
Replying to Ram Narayanan Sastry
...
Sergio,
I tend to partially agree with your opinion that for some customers the problem is only of articulations. But, I think there is also the bigger problem with many customers who actually have a need, but do not know what they want. In my personal experience when I have talked with doctors, they have often told what they need in the context of the software or tools that they currently have. But when we have shown them something very disruptive from their current work, it suddenly dawns on them that what they actually wanted was something else and they whole heartedly join in to support it. I have found that this has happened many times in my experiences with Medical software.

I think it is this aspect that Jobs is trying to point out.
Sorry but now we are "mixing" things in my understanding. The first thing to do is to work on "the problem". The problem will trigger the need. But here is the first key: problem is defined as the gap between the perceived reality and the desire reality. So, we need (the business analyst) must work on the perception or on the desire or on the gap. Most of the time, there is no problem to solve (when you work on the perception). In the case of Apple, 3M, Toyota (where I was the pleasure to work) they go further: they do not have client or customer to work with. That is because Job usually said: clients do not know what they want until you show it to them. I mean, most of the times, when the organization takes a proactive strategy, it has to take into account that there is not a stakeholder to interact with to define the product/service/result. But again, clients or customers always know what they want/desire/wishes and people who have to translate it into requirements must understand that. What you describe is explained by the Lehman Laws of change. Time ago I wrote an article that was published by the PMI. And sorry but the situation demmands a review on the process to get needs (elicitation) and manage stakeholders. We are facing this type of situations into each initiative.
...
1 reply by Ram Narayanan Sastry
Feb 03, 2017 6:33 PM
Ram Narayanan Sastry
...
Probably we are mixing things. Anyhow, I do understand and appreciate your point of view. Thanks for making the discussion interesting.
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