David CohenBusiness Systems Analyst| Between EmployersSkokie, Il, United States
When reporting to a green PM, what is the best way to, as "they" say, manage upwards? What happens when I am told to do a task that make no sense and will take a lot of time and resources to complete and not provide a benefit commensurate with the effort. Saving Changes...
Eric SimmsSenior Program ManagerBaltimore, Maryland, United States
Explain your concerns to the PM, along with your supporting reasons. If the PM refuses to change the task, send the PM those same concerns and supporting reasons in an email and cc: the Sponsor and any other relevant stakeholders, as a way to protect yourself against blame later on. Saving Changes...
Michael ZiyadehContracts Negotiator Sr. | Sikorsky, a Lockheed Martin CompanyBranford, Ct, United States
Also, can you suggest an alternate means of providing what the PM wants without the time and resources required for the initial request? What I have found is that by asking questions of the higher level manager, it helps him/her put the concern in perspective. Some examples of questions you can ask:
What is the benefit you are looking for?
How much time would you like me to devote to this task?
Can I recruit others to help me accomplish this task?
When do you anticipate this completed?
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1 reply by Mudassar Khan
Mar 22, 2017 8:02 AM
Mudassar Khan
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In my opinion the approach described by Michael Ziyadeh should be adopted as it may save resources (time and money )
Saving Changes...
S RajasekarSenior Project Manager| AllscriptsBangalore, Karnataka, India
It happens when PM is only a task master, they don't care about rationale ....
If we escalate and take other routes working condition changes....it become difficult..but for that we can't keep quiet...
Some people never understand and change...we have to deal with that Saving Changes...
Igor ZdorovyakDirector of Projects| ImmunovantFair Lawn, Nj, United States
Hi David,
Sometimes little tasks need to be completed. That's why they pay us the big bucks. Still talk to your functional manager and get their input. If your manager disagrees on the effort vs the result than you can talk to your "Green" PM and see if he/she can provide further justification to perform certain task.
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1 reply by Edward Daniels
Mar 20, 2017 2:08 PM
Edward Daniels
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Hi Igor,
I agree with "little tasks need to be completed" but disagree with "talk to your functional manager and get their input". If the green PM is not the fucntional manager, s/he may unnecessarily escalate matters. David didn't provide too much detail about how long the green PM has been with the organization or if s/he was a former colleague with a new position. From past experiences, expecting a justification from a green manager is always a disaster. They can become unnecessarily insecure and escalate issues when they feel they are being questioned by a subordinate. My advice is to tread carefully with someone who you refer to as GREEN.
Saving Changes...
Edward DanielsProject Manager| IndependentGlen Burnie, Md, United States
In my experience, sometimes your approach is KEY in trying to influence a green PM or a seasoned one. Not saying that you are wrong about the "What happens when I am told to do a task that make no sense and will take a lot of time and resources to complete and not provide a benefit commensurate with the effort" comment. However, I have been wrong in the past when i thought some task made no sense because i didn't have all the facts. It was explained to me why we had to do it and while i still disagreed on the methodology, it was the organization's way of doing business. As long as no one is in harm's way, it may be great to state your thought and push forward a solid argument, if you are unable to convince there is no value, move on, it is not your call. Whatever happens, we as PMPs know that there is a difference between "doing the right" and the "right thing to do". The right thing to do is to always support our colleagues as long as we do everything legal. If we don't get it right, it will be a "lesson learned" for future projects.
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1 reply by S Rajasekar
Mar 20, 2017 2:05 PM
S Rajasekar
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Agree, Well explained.
Saving Changes...
S RajasekarSenior Project Manager| AllscriptsBangalore, Karnataka, India
Mar 20, 2017 2:02 PM
Replying to Edward Daniels
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In my experience, sometimes your approach is KEY in trying to influence a green PM or a seasoned one. Not saying that you are wrong about the "What happens when I am told to do a task that make no sense and will take a lot of time and resources to complete and not provide a benefit commensurate with the effort" comment. However, I have been wrong in the past when i thought some task made no sense because i didn't have all the facts. It was explained to me why we had to do it and while i still disagreed on the methodology, it was the organization's way of doing business. As long as no one is in harm's way, it may be great to state your thought and push forward a solid argument, if you are unable to convince there is no value, move on, it is not your call. Whatever happens, we as PMPs know that there is a difference between "doing the right" and the "right thing to do". The right thing to do is to always support our colleagues as long as we do everything legal. If we don't get it right, it will be a "lesson learned" for future projects.
Agree, Well explained. Saving Changes...
Edward DanielsProject Manager| IndependentGlen Burnie, Md, United States
Mar 20, 2017 1:06 PM
Replying to Igor Zdorovyak
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Hi David,
Sometimes little tasks need to be completed. That's why they pay us the big bucks. Still talk to your functional manager and get their input. If your manager disagrees on the effort vs the result than you can talk to your "Green" PM and see if he/she can provide further justification to perform certain task.
Hi Igor,
I agree with "little tasks need to be completed" but disagree with "talk to your functional manager and get their input". If the green PM is not the fucntional manager, s/he may unnecessarily escalate matters. David didn't provide too much detail about how long the green PM has been with the organization or if s/he was a former colleague with a new position. From past experiences, expecting a justification from a green manager is always a disaster. They can become unnecessarily insecure and escalate issues when they feel they are being questioned by a subordinate. My advice is to tread carefully with someone who you refer to as GREEN. Saving Changes...
Sergio Luis ConteHelping to create solutions for everyone| Worldwide based OrganizationsBuenos Aires, Argentina
Question is: why do you say "task that make no sense"? Usually you do not have all the information to determine that. Understand me: I faced this situation lot of times from both sides (your side and project manager side). That not mean that you do not have to talk with her/him about the situation. But the last accountability rest in the project manager. Saving Changes...
As a fairly new PM, I would urge anyone interacting with a new PM to offer all the advice and patience you can. It is a difficult position to be in, especially when you know you don't know as much as the people you are managing.
During the project, I would offer constructive criticism and point out reading/training material that might help them understand as much of the work as possible.
After the project is complete I would offer a candid and polite assessment of what they did well and what needs work. It behooves all of us to make our teams and PMs better because we are almost certainly destined to interact with them again. Saving Changes...
Very well said Keith and Sergio. The other side, what is the "green" PM thinking? Likely sweating bullets about now being in charge. When I was in that position, mostly I appreciated someone who came to me with ideas, said succinctly, and accepted it if they weren't going to be implemented. Whether the green person or not, often there is much more information that is not shared that is the basis for their position. In the end, I would want a partner to stand by my side, because no matter the level, there is always much to learn from each other. Saving Changes...
