I'm curious to see how many PMPs are out there that are CSMs or planning on being CSMs. Is there anyone out there that plans or has CSM but does not plan on getting PMP certified?
Is it a requirement of your current company or what are your reasons for wanting to get CSM certified and will you continue on to scrum certified practioner? Saving Changes...
I have both my PMP certification and a Scrum Master certification.
Juan Saving Changes...
Dave McMillinSr. Project Manager| TEKsystemsWashington, Il, United States
I am CSM but not PMP and at this point probably will never get the PMP. If a job I want requires it then I'll look into it. I've seen good PMs without the PMP and bad PMs with it. Saving Changes...
Totally concur!! I look at certification for PMP or CSM or anything in IT the same way I look for a dr - just because you have the MD, doesn't mean I'm going to trust you with my life. Know what I mean? It especially chaps my hide when i see courses offered that are designed to get you to pass the exam but not really learn the theory and methodologies behind project management. It's a waste of time and money while devaluing the certification.
I'm just curious because I use to see PMP certification as a way for recruiters to sort through candidates and now I'm starting to see CSM required for a significant number of positions... What made you decide to get your CSM and are you going to continue by getting your CSP? Also, have you worked with any CSMs that made you wonder how they got certified?
thanks,
bethany Saving Changes...
Dave McMillinSr. Project Manager| TEKsystemsWashington, Il, United States
I have no plans to get the CSP. I had a chance to get the CSM and have my company pay for it. I was interested in seeing what it was all about. I have been in IT for 25 years and have seen many of the concepts used before.
As for the CSM I see it like the PMP. It can make a good PM into a great one or can make a bad PM not much better. I got the feeling during the training that some where in the class just to add the CSM to their resume. Saving Changes...
Vincent FongProgram Consultant| WorkAwareSydney, Nsw, Australia
I have CSM however there appears to be a debate between PMP and Prince2. Honestly, I came through the PMBOK but am more inclined towards Prince2. I find the PMBOK too overwhelming on methodology and not specific enough on direction. Prince2 itself is virtually a methodology and specifically directive. My money on Prince2 and CSM as a better mix. Saving Changes...
Dave McMillinSr. Project Manager| TEKsystemsWashington, Il, United States
Don't get me wrong. The PMP has some value. I believe the education behind it can fill in some gaps and maybe make you think about doing something differently instead of trying the same process for every project.
I also believe that if a person has actually worked on projects lead by good PMs, has good mentors, experience different types of projects, can learn from mistakes, etc. that they can become a good PM without the PMP. The PMP does not make up for experience!
Saving Changes...
Anonymous
The CSM certification is even more diluted than the PMP! You take a 2-3 day class and take a test! Guess what everyone that takes the test passes! Big deal, there is no experience requirement needed.
So what is the real value of it other than resume fodder!
CSM will not work if the PM or leader is certifed and your culture inside the company doesn't value it! If you are trying to become a CSM to prove that you belong in IT, perhaps you need to rethink whether you really belong in the first place.
The real value is how many scrum projects have you lead. Saving Changes...
I wanted to learn more about Scrum a few years back, so I took the CSM course from one of the authors of Scrum (Ken Schwaber). It was a good way to get a better understanding of the approach, although I got most of it by reading the book. Even now that you need to write a test, the CSM is a trivial accomplishment. The PMP is a certification of knowledge and experience (the test is hard, or it is used to be, but it's not just about writing a test), it is a much better basic measure of competence and professional capability.
If you are responsible for anything more than a small software development project, you will need to know a lot more about project management than the importance of time-boxing and how to coach a self-managing team, and a few lightweight communication practices which are covered in the CSM.
Since Agile software development is now dominated by Scrum and CSMs (at least until Lean and Kanban gets more mindshare, or some other new idea comes along) it is useful and not difficult or particularly expensive to go join the wave and sign up for the CSM. But it wouldn't influence my hiring decision one way or the other.
The only people that I have seen with the CSP are consultants and trainers, not real practitioners. Saving Changes...
