Simona BonghezManaging Partner| Colors in Projects ltdBucharest, Romania
Why is Ethics a boring topic? Don't get me wrong, I ask this in all sincerity, considering it of utmost importance to our profession. Nevertheless, being involved in the field, I see and feel the reluctance in accepting it as a discussion topic. Why do you think this happens? Saving Changes...
Amany NuseibehSpeaker, Global Leader | Optimal ConsultingSydney, Nsw, Australia
Thank you Simona for this interesting question. I see ethics at the core of everything we do, every thought we have and every decision we make - hence it's interesting and challenging. Having a solid set of values and professional behaviours, a framework for decision making and a set of tools surely equip professional project managers with knowledge and ability to exercise good judgement and take ethical decisions. While I am passionate about ethics, I can understand that some might get defensive, as the topic might challenge their own values or questions their own behaviours, not taking into consideration the endless scenarios that each of us faces every day whether in a professional or non-professional context. Start mentioning specific situations or specific topics and people get more interested. Examples include bullying, harassment, diversity & inclusion, fair trade, and the list goes on That might grab people's attention, as there's more of a personal connection - they might have witnessed it happening either to themselves or others around them, or they want to know more on how to deal with it - just in case. Covid-19 is introducing lots of ethical challenges to everyone; the restrictions and the level of our own personal responsibility to be respectful to all age groups, understanding the implications, flattening the curve so as to be fair to all are put to the test. In Australia, we have seen unethical behavior being at display as people have been fighting to grab the last toilet paper package, or intimidate a worker via spitting on them telling them that you will catch Covid-19! Stories about decisions that need to be made by medical professionals; who lives and who dies are heart breaking! Saving Changes...
Sergio Luis ConteHelping to create solutions for everyone| Worldwide based OrganizationsBuenos Aires, Argentina
Apr 22, 2020 4:05 AM
Replying to Milena Ilieva
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Hi Simona,
very good question, and no, the ethics is not boring. However, the ethics is something that should be thought and learned by example from childhood, at school and in the family. I do not see it as something that can be imposed by any Code of Ethics or books. I see it as principles or/and behaviour that we should follow as humans in our daily life. And then the Code of Ethics comes as a simple reminder to the practitioners that is important in our profession.
Can somebody who has not been raised with the simple ethical rules and behaviour to follow in the daily life, suddenly switch to being ethical in the his profession or projects? Or being able to recognise what is not ethical - it was mentioned by Sergio the situation when a PM is engaged in "non-ethical" projects?
I like "comes as a simple remainder". It implies that ethics is much more than a code. Saving Changes...
Sergio Luis ConteHelping to create solutions for everyone| Worldwide based OrganizationsBuenos Aires, Argentina
Apr 20, 2020 4:32 PM
Replying to Thomas Walenta
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Good point, Sergio.
The PMI code (and those of other organizations like IPMA or APM) look at the how we behave as professionals and not what the projects achieve. As we move more from project to product, the what could also get into the scope of the code.
That is a problem other professions may not see, like doctors, lawyers (though they may bailout criminals ethically) or accountants, journalists.
Would the planner of 911 been able to become a PMP?
The other thing is project management must not be consider a profession. But doctors, lawyers, yes. In the formal and accepted definition that have been stated by governments and others. For example, one of the requirements for a discipline to be consider a profession is to have a legaly actionable code of conduct as a key component of the professional registration. Because it is a real profession a medical doctor (to take an example) can not execute their profession in a different country than she/he obtained her/his professional registration. Just in case she/he like to do that a predefined process to revalidate the credential must be follow. So, the only way people can consider project management a profession is because they are using the boarder definition of profession which is something like "a paid occupation".
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2 replies by Kiron Bondale and Thomas Walenta
Apr 22, 2020 8:16 AM
Kiron Bondale
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This is a really interesting point. When we think of historical big construction/engineering projects where codes of conduct needed to be enforced due to "life and limb" issues, the PM would often have been a professional engineer and that profession's code would have trumped others.
But PMs in other industries may not have started in "professional" roles (i.e. those considered to be professions) which creates the challenge of global compliance. After all, PMI is not the only PM association out there - even if a PM falls afoul of PMI's Code, this wouldn't necessarily mean they are unable to manage projects or join other PM associations.
Kiron
Apr 22, 2020 9:01 AM
Thomas Walenta
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Sergio
my perspective is different, as you might know.
You are right that there are country registered professionals in many global professions. Medical doctors follow a global code of ethics in addition to that registration. PM as a young profession is only registered in few countries yet, e.g. UK.
Code of ethics NEVER are legally enforceable, but they are sometimes enforced by professional bodies like PMI or also for doctors or journalists or lawyers.
We all are bound by many group norms, laws, codes. Many hospitals have own code of ethics, and doctors working there have follow at least 2 codes plus local laws. Similar to construction PMs, they commit to construction based norms and if they are PMP to the PMI code.
And yes, this is another source for ethical dilemmas.
The other thing is project management must not be consider a profession. But doctors, lawyers, yes. In the formal and accepted definition that have been stated by governments and others. For example, one of the requirements for a discipline to be consider a profession is to have a legaly actionable code of conduct as a key component of the professional registration. Because it is a real profession a medical doctor (to take an example) can not execute their profession in a different country than she/he obtained her/his professional registration. Just in case she/he like to do that a predefined process to revalidate the credential must be follow. So, the only way people can consider project management a profession is because they are using the boarder definition of profession which is something like "a paid occupation".
This is a really interesting point. When we think of historical big construction/engineering projects where codes of conduct needed to be enforced due to "life and limb" issues, the PM would often have been a professional engineer and that profession's code would have trumped others.
But PMs in other industries may not have started in "professional" roles (i.e. those considered to be professions) which creates the challenge of global compliance. After all, PMI is not the only PM association out there - even if a PM falls afoul of PMI's Code, this wouldn't necessarily mean they are unable to manage projects or join other PM associations.
Kiron Saving Changes...
Thomas WalentaGlobal Project Economy ExpertHackenheim, Germany
Apr 22, 2020 7:45 AM
Replying to Sergio Luis Conte
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The other thing is project management must not be consider a profession. But doctors, lawyers, yes. In the formal and accepted definition that have been stated by governments and others. For example, one of the requirements for a discipline to be consider a profession is to have a legaly actionable code of conduct as a key component of the professional registration. Because it is a real profession a medical doctor (to take an example) can not execute their profession in a different country than she/he obtained her/his professional registration. Just in case she/he like to do that a predefined process to revalidate the credential must be follow. So, the only way people can consider project management a profession is because they are using the boarder definition of profession which is something like "a paid occupation".
Sergio
my perspective is different, as you might know.
You are right that there are country registered professionals in many global professions. Medical doctors follow a global code of ethics in addition to that registration. PM as a young profession is only registered in few countries yet, e.g. UK.
Code of ethics NEVER are legally enforceable, but they are sometimes enforced by professional bodies like PMI or also for doctors or journalists or lawyers.
We all are bound by many group norms, laws, codes. Many hospitals have own code of ethics, and doctors working there have follow at least 2 codes plus local laws. Similar to construction PMs, they commit to construction based norms and if they are PMP to the PMI code.
And yes, this is another source for ethical dilemmas.
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1 reply by Sergio Luis Conte
Apr 22, 2020 9:54 AM
Sergio Luis Conte
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Code of ethic in a real profession is not legally enforceable. It is legally actionable, which is not the same. There is no way that a discipline can be consider a profession if some critical points are not followed. Those critical points are because the demange a discipline can create with those actions. So, my point is, in the extreme, call project management a profession is disrespect real professions like doctors and others. Just my line of thinking and behave. For me, what a profession formaly implies is a very serious thing to be taken into account (I do not find other word but I am not saying that is not serious for other because the comments above).
Saving Changes...
Sergio Luis ConteHelping to create solutions for everyone| Worldwide based OrganizationsBuenos Aires, Argentina
Apr 22, 2020 9:01 AM
Replying to Thomas Walenta
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Sergio
my perspective is different, as you might know.
You are right that there are country registered professionals in many global professions. Medical doctors follow a global code of ethics in addition to that registration. PM as a young profession is only registered in few countries yet, e.g. UK.
Code of ethics NEVER are legally enforceable, but they are sometimes enforced by professional bodies like PMI or also for doctors or journalists or lawyers.
We all are bound by many group norms, laws, codes. Many hospitals have own code of ethics, and doctors working there have follow at least 2 codes plus local laws. Similar to construction PMs, they commit to construction based norms and if they are PMP to the PMI code.
And yes, this is another source for ethical dilemmas.
Code of ethic in a real profession is not legally enforceable. It is legally actionable, which is not the same. There is no way that a discipline can be consider a profession if some critical points are not followed. Those critical points are because the demange a discipline can create with those actions. So, my point is, in the extreme, call project management a profession is disrespect real professions like doctors and others. Just my line of thinking and behave. For me, what a profession formaly implies is a very serious thing to be taken into account (I do not find other word but I am not saying that is not serious for other because the comments above).
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1 reply by Thomas Walenta
Apr 22, 2020 11:20 AM
Thomas Walenta
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Sergio
Codes of ethics are also not legally actionable. Ethics and laws are different things, though a violation of ethics might sometimes constitute also a violation of law and vice versa.
Show me a code of ethics that is legally actionable.
PM is a profession in development, and other than with e.g. lawyers or journalists there is a global code of ethics available.
Saving Changes...
Thomas WalentaGlobal Project Economy ExpertHackenheim, Germany
Apr 22, 2020 9:54 AM
Replying to Sergio Luis Conte
...
Code of ethic in a real profession is not legally enforceable. It is legally actionable, which is not the same. There is no way that a discipline can be consider a profession if some critical points are not followed. Those critical points are because the demange a discipline can create with those actions. So, my point is, in the extreme, call project management a profession is disrespect real professions like doctors and others. Just my line of thinking and behave. For me, what a profession formaly implies is a very serious thing to be taken into account (I do not find other word but I am not saying that is not serious for other because the comments above).
Sergio
Codes of ethics are also not legally actionable. Ethics and laws are different things, though a violation of ethics might sometimes constitute also a violation of law and vice versa.
Show me a code of ethics that is legally actionable.
PM is a profession in development, and other than with e.g. lawyers or journalists there is a global code of ethics available. Saving Changes...
Stéphane ParentSelf Employed / Semi-retired| Leader MakerPrince Edward Island, Canada
The problem with discussing ethics is the multiplicity of them. You have, at a minimum, a professional code of ethics, an organizational code of ethics and, finally, a personal code of ethics. While there is hopefully a lot of overlap across them, it can still be difficult to frame discussions within the appropriate level(s) of thinking.
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2 replies by Sergio Luis Conte and Thomas Walenta
Apr 22, 2020 12:38 PM
Thomas Walenta
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Stephane,
agree, and it is not only about the different ethics codes, it is about any norms, beliefs and values (the culture) of the communities we are part of.
Think about family, spouse, school, job, employer, team, profession, etc. Everything we do is somehow the result of considering all these parameters. Our brain seems to be able to do that intuitively, but sometimes we run into conflicts between values or beliefs, which then may constitute an ethical dilemma.
Apr 22, 2020 12:39 PM
Sergio Luis Conte
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You hit the mail. Adding to that is what a discipline must address to be consider a profession because in this case things,that must be defined as a requirement, like code of ethic must be address local laws and jurisdictions. On top of all of that, totally independient of "papers" is the real debate about ethic that must be done in the field of phylosophy and they are totally influence by things like culture. For example, the way in which women are treated in some countries is totally unethical for me but it is not for the people of that country nor for many others who do not make the slightest comment for doing business with them even when being in a meeting business where they see that reality. Or project managers working on projects that generate weapons of mass destruction is totally unethical for me but for some organizations it seems that is not the case because they grant credentials to these people. This would be prohibited for a doctor due to the code of medical ethics because it would be a crime and could go to jail. Then, if we will debate ethics, just in case we will do that out of any framework and using personal perception then it will be boring and with no sense for me.
Saving Changes...
Albert AgbemenuManaging Director| Seag Focus Ghana LtdAccra, Ghana
Hi Simona,
Great topic.
I think ethics could be seen as a boring topic just because a person may perceive it to look like a police officer watching over all your movements. Every rational human being, irrespective of background, has some natural intuition that is able to differentiate between good and bad or what is morally right or wrong. So even without any sets of rules or codes, people must be able to distinguish between right and wrong. It is however, our motivational values that makes us behave in a particular way whether there are control measures in place or not.
As a professional, one does not even need any set of codes before doing the right thing. Even with the existence of all these codes and other sets of rules, people are still motivated to do the wrong things just for obvious reasons.
So, ethics may sound very sweet in the ears of people who want to remain upright but boring to those who are always looking for opportunities to be corrupt.
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1 reply by Thomas Walenta
Apr 22, 2020 12:46 PM
Thomas Walenta
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Good points, Albert.
Ethics too often is seen as limiting and policing while it could be enabling. It is sometimes good to have a framework, like a good checklist, to do things based on good practice. Our intuition works well if we made an experience before, but not so much if we run into a situation for the first time.
Before using a code of ethics as a sanctioning instrument, we should use it as a development tool: think about what you will do in specific situations, maybe learn in simulations (like we do for negotiations), read stories about ethical solutions.
The question is how to become a good (ethical) person. You can rely on intuition, or on punishing bad behavior, but as we know from elsewhere, learning by positive feedback is a better way.
Saving Changes...
Thomas WalentaGlobal Project Economy ExpertHackenheim, Germany
Apr 22, 2020 11:40 AM
Replying to Stéphane Parent
...
The problem with discussing ethics is the multiplicity of them. You have, at a minimum, a professional code of ethics, an organizational code of ethics and, finally, a personal code of ethics. While there is hopefully a lot of overlap across them, it can still be difficult to frame discussions within the appropriate level(s) of thinking.
Stephane,
agree, and it is not only about the different ethics codes, it is about any norms, beliefs and values (the culture) of the communities we are part of.
Think about family, spouse, school, job, employer, team, profession, etc. Everything we do is somehow the result of considering all these parameters. Our brain seems to be able to do that intuitively, but sometimes we run into conflicts between values or beliefs, which then may constitute an ethical dilemma. Saving Changes...