Steven ZacharyDirector| Alberta Health ServicesCalgary, Alberta, Canada
I hear this question frequently. In fact I just watched a presentation on it last week.
The thinking goes something like this. The roles are close enough that "exceptional" people can do both roles inside the same project.
Another line of thinking goes the roles should be merged.
It makes zero sense in my humble opinion. There's simply too much work for either role to be done well as a combo. It's not that someone can't succeed in a combination role. I think they can, we've all been there once in our careers.
It's just that I don't think one could EXCEL in that type of combination role without offsetting roles or some delegation structure. What are your thoughts and ramblings about the PM and BA relationship? Saving Changes...
Sergio Luis ConteHelping to create solutions for everyone| Worldwide based OrganizationsBuenos Aires, Argentina
About responsability on requirements it is simple. PM is focused on project requirements while BA is focused on product/service/results requiements. In other words, BA focus is poduct/service/result scope while PM focus is project scope. The key thing is: project scope is determined by product scope. Obviously the BA work starts before the project exists and continues after the project ends. We have to remember that some things like assumptions and restrictions will impact the whole solution (project PLUS product) and can be considered requirements. Saving Changes...
Sergio, I totally agree. As I stated sometime in the past, "requirements live long before a project and will live long after the project". (O.K. a single requirement will change over time and maybe live shorter than a project) That's why I got my CPRE (more known in Europe) before my PMP.
From my point of view, requirements start with the first idea - or even before that, since an idea is a "solution idea" for some requirements. It's only that we didn't elicit them so far. So in the past I had the idea, that BA is leading PM - but I didn't work it out to create a standard :-) Saving Changes...
Regarding the roles, I support the view "it depends" - on project, product, "environment" and capabilities and knowledge of the people involved. I support Cheryl in that I think the roles/tasks have to be executed - let's see who in the team can do what best to reach business goals. Maybe a somewhat agile inspired approach :-) Saving Changes...
Sergio Luis ConteHelping to create solutions for everyone| Worldwide based OrganizationsBuenos Aires, Argentina
Not problem about to create the standard because standards or guides are only a point of reference and, in my case, to do not reinvent the wheel but we need to adjust our work to organizational needs. BA and PM are totally separate roles and one is not leading on the other. BA focus is the whole solution (solution = "the thing" to be created (product/service/result) + "the process" (project) to create it) and her/his work start before the project exists and continue after the project ends. PM focus is work, the work needed to create "the thing" as defined (what is a matter of quality) with the stated constraints and assumptions. Both have to work together because project scope is defined from product scope and business analyst will help to the PM along the project when changes happends and with all realted to assure the project quality. Saving Changes...
@Sergio: you're right, it's not about standards. That was merely a joke at the end of my statement. And I didn't argue about roles in case of leading one the other - but more from structural and disciplines view. My experience is, that people should always work together towards business goals. It's no good to argue about "this is mine and this is yours". Everybody should and will do its best to reach project and/or product/service goals. Maybe I was lucky, but BA and PM roles have been always aligned and working together in my past experience. Sometimes it took some time to get to that - but we always reached that state. And in my experience, roles are not always one-to-one (or one-to-many) distributed to team members, sometimes it's a many-to-many distribution. It might work, if everyone is aligned to go for the targeted vision. Saving Changes...
Sergio Luis ConteHelping to create solutions for everyone| Worldwide based OrganizationsBuenos Aires, Argentina
I understood your point Rolf. And I fully agree with you. What I tried to clarify in the best english I can, just in case my comments was not understood, is about that. Unfortunatelly there are a lot of missunderstanding in the market about lot of things like business analysis, agile, leadership and others. Thanks for give the opportunity to learn from your comment. Saving Changes...
Christina ShumakerVP, Sr. Process Improvement Consultant| PNC BankWellington, Oh, United States
Good Afternoon All,
I often times find myself performing the Hybrid role of Business Analyst and Project Manager in order to complete smaller project initiatives on time (note - I am in the Financial Industry). Generally, these initiatives are those that are within a functional line of business outside of the control of a PMO. While I do this to deliver results, I am curious as to the Pros and Cons of taking on this role and how many others within other industries find themselves in a similar role who are able to share reputable resource information (books, articles, websites) with me that I can use to construct a presentation to my fellow colleagues within my organization. I happened on this post and thought the responders here would be a good place to start my quest for information.
Thank you in advance for any resource info you are able to share.
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1 reply by Naomi Caietti
Apr 04, 2017 4:31 PM
Naomi Caietti
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Contact Vicki James here or on Linked in. She just wrote a book and I'm sure she'd have lots to share.
Steven:
In a perfect world, the roles and responsibilities are unique, projects should demand to have three champions: PM, BA and Sponsor at the beginning and it's a perfect partnership for success. Unfortunately, organizations are stretched thin, think that a PM can and should do both roles, underestimate the engagement required for the roles and your superstar can get burned out.
A great PM should be able to dance between both roles but they would be better served to rally and negotiate to fill the role as a benefit, long tern investment and partnership to add value through outcomes done with people.
Besides the BA role is evolving due to more complex projects so they should sit side by side the PM at the table. Saving Changes...
I often times find myself performing the Hybrid role of Business Analyst and Project Manager in order to complete smaller project initiatives on time (note - I am in the Financial Industry). Generally, these initiatives are those that are within a functional line of business outside of the control of a PMO. While I do this to deliver results, I am curious as to the Pros and Cons of taking on this role and how many others within other industries find themselves in a similar role who are able to share reputable resource information (books, articles, websites) with me that I can use to construct a presentation to my fellow colleagues within my organization. I happened on this post and thought the responders here would be a good place to start my quest for information.
Thank you in advance for any resource info you are able to share.
Contact Vicki James here or on Linked in. She just wrote a book and I'm sure she'd have lots to share. Saving Changes...
Deepesh RammoorthyICT Project Manager ( PMP®AgilePM®Certified ScrumMaster® (CSM®))| Australian Red Cross Blood ServiceTarneit, Vic, Australia
I would vouch for having both skill sets but just doing one job at any given Time. You can be a lead BA on a project and not have to do Project Management . On another project you can be a PM and not have to do BA. You can ask your manager to separate your responsibilities on different projects so you get a good exposure of both worlds without losing your focus on the respective projects . Utopia it would be ! Saving Changes...
